Now this is just one heckuva moral dilemma. [Repeat] burglar discovers evidence of child molestation during burglary. Burglar [anonymously] turns it in. Police arrest child molester. Police later arrest burglar on another charge. Burglar requests clemency, citing his assistance in catching the child molester. What to do?
Human instinct would be to laud the burglar for helping with the capture of a scumbag, for lack of a better term. However, he still did commit crimes, and continued to do so after turning in the evidence; which he did anonymously. Where's the heroism in that?
Personally, I say reduce the burglar's sentence. One good deed does not undo twelve (in this case) bad ones. It does help, however. And as far as karma is concerned, I would say a deed such as this would balance out a great many grievances.
As to the child molester... I'm torn between two options, both of which would have the same result: either give him a prison sentence (where he would be subsequently beaten to death by the other inmates upon their learning of his crime), or give him to the girl's parents. However, this also goes against my feelings on capital punishment. Granted, the state would be in neither case actually killing the man. Since the latter is not going to be a reality, the only real way to avoid his death in prison would be to put him in solitary. Some might argue that would be far worse than death.
Does everyone deserve a second chance? Even people such as that? Or are some crimes so heinous that death is the only morally sound choice?
He took something from that girl which she can never have back. It will very likely affect her life in a negative way. Where's the justice if he only gets a prison sentence (assuming he survived)? "An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind," said Gandhi. An admirable maxim to be sure, and one that flies in the face of human justice. Should the girl and her parents forgive and forget? I've heard of parents being able to forgive their child's murderer, which is arguably worse than molestation; so forgiveness is possible in even the most extreme cases.
While on this subject, I've a related topic: that of forgiveness by God; or more specifically, Jesus. Christianity teaches that no matter what, a truly repentant person will be forgiven. There are no exceptions (well, except for this one - and it's open to debate), no matter how repugnant the sin. It's a beautiful idea to be sure, but again lacks human justice. A fitting analogy is the story of the thief on the cross. A thief is perhaps not the most horrible of criminals, but is by no means innocent. And yet at the last moment (quite literally), by believing the man hanging next to him could save him from eternal damnation, he is lifted into paradise (which may or may not be heaven: again, subject to debate). So where is the recompense to the people who were stolen from? Somehow I doubt God is cutting checks to the victims. In a more interesting case, let us use the original story. What if the molester were to become a Christian? From the Bible's standpoint, he is forgiven, and will be in heaven. So Gandhi goes to hell, and a child molester goes to heaven. Yeah, that's fair. And again, where is the recompense for the girl or her parents? It's not as though time will be reversed, and innocence restored. Biblical morality falls short, methinks.
Human instinct would be to laud the burglar for helping with the capture of a scumbag, for lack of a better term. However, he still did commit crimes, and continued to do so after turning in the evidence; which he did anonymously. Where's the heroism in that?
Personally, I say reduce the burglar's sentence. One good deed does not undo twelve (in this case) bad ones. It does help, however. And as far as karma is concerned, I would say a deed such as this would balance out a great many grievances.
As to the child molester... I'm torn between two options, both of which would have the same result: either give him a prison sentence (where he would be subsequently beaten to death by the other inmates upon their learning of his crime), or give him to the girl's parents. However, this also goes against my feelings on capital punishment. Granted, the state would be in neither case actually killing the man. Since the latter is not going to be a reality, the only real way to avoid his death in prison would be to put him in solitary. Some might argue that would be far worse than death.
Does everyone deserve a second chance? Even people such as that? Or are some crimes so heinous that death is the only morally sound choice?
He took something from that girl which she can never have back. It will very likely affect her life in a negative way. Where's the justice if he only gets a prison sentence (assuming he survived)? "An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind," said Gandhi. An admirable maxim to be sure, and one that flies in the face of human justice. Should the girl and her parents forgive and forget? I've heard of parents being able to forgive their child's murderer, which is arguably worse than molestation; so forgiveness is possible in even the most extreme cases.
While on this subject, I've a related topic: that of forgiveness by God; or more specifically, Jesus. Christianity teaches that no matter what, a truly repentant person will be forgiven. There are no exceptions (well, except for this one - and it's open to debate), no matter how repugnant the sin. It's a beautiful idea to be sure, but again lacks human justice. A fitting analogy is the story of the thief on the cross. A thief is perhaps not the most horrible of criminals, but is by no means innocent. And yet at the last moment (quite literally), by believing the man hanging next to him could save him from eternal damnation, he is lifted into paradise (which may or may not be heaven: again, subject to debate). So where is the recompense to the people who were stolen from? Somehow I doubt God is cutting checks to the victims. In a more interesting case, let us use the original story. What if the molester were to become a Christian? From the Bible's standpoint, he is forgiven, and will be in heaven. So Gandhi goes to hell, and a child molester goes to heaven. Yeah, that's fair. And again, where is the recompense for the girl or her parents? It's not as though time will be reversed, and innocence restored. Biblical morality falls short, methinks.
posted by Stephonovich at
17:45
3 Comments:
Well... according to the Bible, just because you believe doesn't mean you'll be forgiven. See Acts 8:21-22
"You have no part or share in this ministry, becuase your heart is not right before God. Repent of this wickedness and pray to the Lord. Perhaps he will forvige you for having such a thought in your heart."
*Perhaps* being the key word here. So... with Christian morality and grace, it's a guessing game. Maybe you're forgiven, maybe you aren't. Maybe you're going to heaven, maybe you aren't.
As for the crime, I'm really not sure. Obviously the family can't be *expected* to forgive, though if they do, then great. But it's not something that can be demanded or can just given out like anti-war flyers.
I think that the fact that the thief did turn in the evidence should play a part in the decision of his punishment. Obviously it doesn't overwrite all of the things he did, but, that fact in mind, I personally believe that sentence should be lightened due to it.
By
that girl, at 10 May, 2006 08:24
Well, perhaps indeed. But let's assume for the moment that forgiveness is guaranteed (after all, it's what we're told). How is it still justified, since the human victims are still left suffering? How is that fair?
By
Stephonovich, at 10 May, 2006 12:45
Firstly... since this has now turned into a religious discussion, I encourage you to read my post on the matter (if you have not already done so), archived here. It will let you see where I'm coming from.
so you see, you can't just take one verse, see what you want to see, and throw everything out the window just because you want to.
This is true; however, I'm not seeing it in the particular verse in question. Simon merely asks (in ignorance) how he can acquire this miracle healing power. He assumes it can be purchased, as is often the case with power. He is then somewhat piously rebuked, and to top it off, told that God might forgive him. In my mind, anyway, the apostles created their own version of God's love and forgiveness.
i sense bitterness... and that saddens me. believe it or not, God isn't out to get you, and he really does love you.
At least you care. Matters more than you'd think. To avoid reiterating, read the post I mentioned at the beginning. Will explain a lot.
you can't put people on scales and say, oh he did more bad things, hes going to hell. everything in the bible is against thinking like that.
I can't, as a single person. A large group of people in agreeance (i.e. a court of law) can. And no, the Bible is most definitely thinking like that, except it uses God as the gold standard. Yes, it can be argued that an omnipotent being has every right to make up whatever rules he or she wants, but when said ruler has exhibited such hatred for his own creation, and such apparent lack of feelings for those damned to hell; it makes it very difficult to follow him, much less worship him. I think another post of mine you might enjoy (or at least, should read) is the one on maltheism.
but just because someone on earth refuses to forgive you, doesn't mean God is the same.
I have but one reply: Unforgivable Sin. Explain that one.
back to the subject of victims forgiving the people that hurt them, look up the story of Corrie Ten Boom ...
Indeed, I have read it. It is a marvelously encouraging story. As I said, forgiveness even in extreme circumstances is by far one of the noblest things one can do. Never said it was wrong. Just that it can't be expected of people, as every fiber of our being is programmed against that.
i would answer the othe questions you posed, but already this comment is far too long. i bid thee a fond farewell, keep up the writing sir, you write very well.
It really doesn't bother me. Long comments are fun. Can email or IM if you wish, though - let me know and I'll give you my contact info.
By
Stephonovich, at 11 May, 2006 11:27
Post a Comment
<< Home